Episode 49: Skincare Storage Mistakes You Might Be Making

We're back for another episode of Beauty IQ Uncensored, brought to you by Adore Beauty. 

What’s on this episode? We’re glad you asked...

Are sheet masks for your vagina a bit ridiculous?

We test drove these new vagina sheet masks so you didn't have to...and the verdict is, well, it's not really necessary - and the Shameless girls agreed.

Also, if gynaecologists don't recommend it, then neither do we, but we're willing to get a yeast infection if it's for content. 

Beauty storage 101 with Dr Michele Squire

Dr Squire is a PhD-qualified scientist, science educator, former Registered Nurse and founder of Qr8, a skincare consultancy platform.

We discuss product storage, keeping your stuff in the bathroom, poo particles, knowing when your products are expired, and what differentiates a cosmeceutical product.

You can check out Dr Squire's consultancy platform Qr8 here.

PWDKWN:

Jo: Baebrow Instant Eyebrow Tint

Hannah: L’Oreal Professional Hair Touch Up

Read our disclaimer.

Hosts: Joanna Fleming & Hannah Furst

Guests: Dr Michele Squire

We share our verdicts on new vagina sheet masks and chat to Dr Michele Squire on how to properly store your skincare.

Beauty IQ Uncensored Episode 49 Transcript - 'Skincare Storage Mistakes You Might Be Making'

 

Hannah Furst:                    Welcome everybody to Beauty IQ the podcast.

Joanna Flemming:            I'm your host, Joanna Flemming.

Hannah Furst:                    And I am your cohost, Hannah Furst. I've got this like secret iso shame. As you know, I've been ordering my meals online. And I've been getting these plant-based vegan healthy meals delivered. And then what happens is, curfew kicks in at 8:00, and so I can't walk down to the petrol station or the 7-Eleven to get a snack.

Joanna Flemming:            Yeah.

Hannah Furst:                    I end up ordering McDonald's pretty much every single night at around midnight.

Joanna Flemming:            Is it because you're hungry, because you haven't had enough to eat?

Hannah Furst:                    I'm craving Maccas, I feel a monster has taken over my body and-

Joanna Flemming:            I have no judgement  for you getting late night Maccas.

Hannah Furst:                    I don't even eat Maccas. But anyway, so I order a large Fanta, I order the cheeseburger shaker fries, and then I dip the shaker fries in Big Mac special sauce. And then I also get a gravy fries, and I eat the whole thing in bed, before I go to sleep.

Joanna Flemming:            See, I'm interested that you don't get anything sweet, because I'm a sweet tooth at night. I couldn't eat savoury food that late, I don't think.

Hannah Furst:                    Oh, the Fanta. The Fanta is my sugar rush. But what was really interesting, I posted it to stories, and what was the best thing about doing that was that we're all doing the same thing. It's not just me.

Joanna Flemming:            Yeah, that's why I don't think you need to have any shame about it. Honestly, we're living through a pandemic, eat as much Maccas as you want.

Hannah Furst:                    So someone eats a block of Cadbury chocolate every night.

Joanna Flemming:            Sounds like me, was that me?

Hannah Furst:                    Someone wakes up in the night and eats chips, choccie, cookie dough ice cream. Someone Uber Eats a cup of steamed rice so that they don't have to put a bra on to go to the store next door. That was probably one of my favourites. And then I loved... This is my favourite. I couldn't fit this into the chat box. My housemates and I have developed a Krispy Kreme obsession during iso.

Joanna Flemming:            Oh, I love Krispy Kreme.

Hannah Furst:                    So much so, we've ranked 7-Elevens on freshness, reliability and taste. We call the top three, the golden triangle, which is the trio of 7-Elevens on Melvin Road, Chapel and High Street. Very reliable, often fresh, always tasty. How 2020 is that?

Joanna Flemming:            I just think life is too short to feel guilty about eating food that you want to eat.

Hannah Furst:                    It's not about the food, I'm spending $20 every night.

Joanna Flemming:            Oh, who gives a shit? You haven't been out in six months.

Hannah Furst:                    But I'm already paying a premium for delivered fresh meals. Plus, on top of that, I'm spending $100 a week on Maccas.

Joanna Flemming:            I must say, it does kind of defeat the purpose of your Soulara meals. I will give you that.

Hannah Furst:                    It does.

Joanna Flemming:            Yeah, it does. But-

Hannah Furst:                    I've cancelled them as of-

Joanna Flemming:            Okay. Yeah.

Hannah Furst:                    I'm getting one more delivery. The other option is I go up to the supermarket and I buy some frozen hash browns and I just keep them in the freezer for when I'm desperate.

Joanna Flemming:            Yeah, good idea. Those ones are probably a little bit healthier as well, maybe. I've been doing HelloFresh, and, yeah, I love that. You should try HelloFresh actually.

Hannah Furst:                    I don't want to cook.

Joanna Flemming:            Okay.

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah.

Joanna Flemming:            Okay, there goes that. All right, anyway, what is on today's episode, Hannah?

Hannah Furst:                    On today's episode, our cringey combo, we are doing a little tried-and-tested of a mask where-

Joanna Flemming:            It goes on your vagina.

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah. It goes on your vagina. We're speaking to Dr. Michele Squire on how to store your products. And of course, the products we didn't know we needed.

Joanna Flemming:            We both did something this morning.

Hannah Furst:                    Yes.

Joanna Flemming:            A little bit of self care, I'd say. It falls under that category. You've just told me that you've got your used mask there.

Hannah Furst:                    Yep. I think I'll just show what it looks like.

Joanna Flemming:            I don't need to see it. Actually, yes. Visually we need to show what it looks like, because I didn't know how to put it on.

Hannah Furst:                    It looks like a nappy.

Joanna Flemming:            It does. Yeah, it does. So we both tried a vagina mask. So the reason that this has come about is because a new brand launched, not with Adore Beauty, just in general. And I got sent two masks.

Hannah Furst:                    Yep.

Joanna Flemming:            And I messaged you, Hannah. And I said, "Hey, I've got a vagina mask. Do you want to try one?" And you said, "Of course."

Hannah Furst:                    Of course.

Joanna Flemming:            So I sent one to you.

Hannah Furst:                    Right up my alley.

Joanna Flemming:            And we both tried it this morning, so we're going to be doing our first impressions.

Hannah Furst:                    It's like a sheet mask for your vagina. But to be totally honest with you, maybe I didn't use it properly. I was like, "Sorry, this is a stomach mask. That's not-"

Joanna Flemming:            It's huge. I was like, "Do these people know how big a vagina is?" I don't know.

Hannah Furst:                    It's a stomach mask with a little bit extra for you vagina. That's how I felt.

Joanna Flemming:            Yes, totally. Yeah. It seems too big for just a vagina.

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah. I agree with that. So I guess what had happened was you sent it to me and then I went and listened to that episode of Shameless.

Joanna Flemming:            Yes.

Hannah Furst:                    They chatted about vagina masks.

Joanna Flemming:            Were they talking about the same mask that we used?

Hannah Furst:                    Same mask.

Joanna Flemming:            Okay, interesting, yeah.

Hannah Furst:                    I think that they got sent a press release, and so I really agreed with their... I don't know, I think it's okay to use something like this. It's expensive, so I don't know how much you want to spend on something like this, but if you've had laser hair removal... But I would just use my Laseraid to be totally honest with you. It's really similar to using Laseraid.

Joanna Flemming:            Well, that's the thing is, that this is designed to be used after hair removal. I looked at the ingredients. It has willow bark extract, pineapple fruit extract, which is like a gentle AHA, it's got Aloe vera. So I think it's meant to be like a soothing thing. But for me, I was just like, "I could understand if this was in a gel or a serum texture for post hair-removal treatment or soothing of the skin, but a sheet mask?"

Hannah Furst:                    I know.

Joanna Flemming:            Is it just trying to be different?

Hannah Furst:                    I think that what Shameless had said was-

Joanna Flemming:            Yeah, what was their opinion on it?

Hannah Furst:                    Well, because there was a lot of stuff around, I think, in the press release that they got, there was maybe, yes, soothing and hair removal, but also anti ageing, which I think-

Joanna Flemming:            Oh my God.

Hannah Furst:                    ... it's like, you've never... Their issue, I think, was that, "Well, we've never thought about that before." I was really reminded of that Femfresh episode we did, because you were like, "It makes women feel like there's something wrong when there's not."

Joanna Flemming:            Yep. And I do want to remind everybody, your vagina is normal. It shouldn't smell like strawberries. It should smell like a vagina. That's what it is. It's a vagina. So let's not try and sugar coat it, which I think is what a lot of these products do. You know how you spoke about that [Lady Sweet 00:00:06:28] brand the other week?

Hannah Furst:                    Yes.

Joanna Flemming:            And you tried their oil and stuff. Don't mind that stuff because it's not actually going on your vagina. It's going on your pubic area where you've maybe had laser or you've had waxing or whatever.

Hannah Furst:                    Or you've shaved that area, pre laser, and you're getting-

Joanna Flemming:            Yeah.

Hannah Furst:                    Yep.

Joanna Flemming:            And you don't want ingrowns and stuff like that. Fair enough. But when it's trying to, like... I don't know, it's almost like glamorising vaginas. I don't know. I've got a bit of a weird feeling about it.

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah. I'm like the anti-ageing aspect. I'm like, "No, my vagina's not... I'm not even thinking about that." Like :No."

Joanna Flemming:            I'd worry about my face. My vagina is not as much of a concern.

Hannah Furst:                    Okay, can I be honest with you? I was like, "Put it on." I was sitting down in my bathroom after the shower, I was like, "This is frickin cold." I was like, "Ooh."

Joanna Flemming:            Oh my God. I thought the same thing. I put it on, and I was like, "Oh my God, it's freezing." It was like having an ice bath.

Hannah Furst:                    Yes, that's what I felt like. I think the overall... I don't think it's necessary.

Joanna Flemming:            Look, the reason that we're talking about this as well is so that you guys don't have to try it.

Hannah Furst:                    Yes, totally.

Joanna Flemming:            You don't have to go and spend the money on it. We're talking about it, we're trying it, to tell you about it. And same goes for v-steaming and yoni steaming. Which v-steaming is where you over a bucket of herbs and the brand that I tried... And this is just like, just tried it for laughs, says that it can cleanse your past lovers and stuff like that. And I was like, "Oh, I'm so giving this a crack."

Hannah Furst:                    I need some of that in my life.

Joanna Flemming:            Yeah, I know. That's what I was thought, I was like, "Maybe I should give this to Hannah?"

Hannah Furst:                    Does it erase it from your memory?

Joanna Flemming:            I don't know if it's that powerful, but it came with a bag of herbs and then a little wooden seat that you put over a bucket and you put hot water in there and you soak all the herbs and stuff. And then you sit on it.

Hannah Furst:                    That reminds me of colonics in Thailand.

Joanna Flemming:            Yes.

Hannah Furst:                    The wooden board.

Joanna Flemming:            Have you seen that photo of Chrissy Tiegen doing it? Not a colonics-

Hannah Furst:                    Yes.

Joanna Flemming:            ... a vagina steam.

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah, I've seen that.

Joanna Flemming:            Yeah. And I think Gwyneth Paltrow also does it as well. But again, none of these vagina treatments are recommended by gynaecologists at all. Gynaecologists are like, "Don't mess with it. Just let it do its thing."

Hannah Furst:                    So for me, the message is, "Don't mess with your vagina."

Joanna Flemming:            I swear if I get a yeast infection from this sheet mask, I'm suing. Today's guest that's joining us has a very long resume. Dr. Michele Squire is a PhD qualified scientists, a science educator, a former registered nurse, and also the founder of QR8, which is spelled Q-R-8, which is a skincare-consultancy platform. Welcome Dr. Michelle Squire.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Thank you so much for having me. It's a joy to be chatting to you today.

Joanna Flemming:            I'm really interested to discuss this topic because it's a little bit different to what we'd normally do. And today we're going to start off talking about product storage because you recently contributed to an article for our platform, Beauty IQ, and that was all around how to store beauty products correctly. So are most of us doing it wrong?

Dr Michele Squi...:           Look, I think the answer that is probably, "Yes." There's a convenience factor of jumping out of the shower at night or in the morning when you're kind of, your face is damp, that's usually the time to get going on your skincare. And so most of us actually store our products on the bathroom shelf, especially for people I think who use multiple products and who kind of pick and choose on a kind of rotating basis as the mood strikes them, or their skincare needs strike them. Often they have even kind of twirling devices with all of their skincare set up there. So I think the bathroom shelf is the obvious spot where most people store their products. And it's probably the worst place you can actually store your products.

Joanna Flemming:            Okay. Great. We've covered that off, so we're all doing it wrong.

Hannah Furst:                    Where should you be storing your skincare? What are some other places?

Dr Michele Squi...:           Are we going to get down into the science right now? Are we getting into it?

Joanna Flemming:            Yeah, let's do it.

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah, I think so. Definitely.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Okay. All right. So the problem with the bathroom shelf is that it's very exposed. So heat, humidity, light, both visible light, so sunlight and light from kind of heating lamps and your bathroom lighting, which tends to actually be in most houses, some of the best light in the house. You've got some of the brightest light in the house in your bathroom. They're the big culprits here. What happens in any product, there's lots of molecules that are kind of moving around randomly and banging against each other and undergoing reactions at the same time, both with each other and also with the kind of air and light and oxygen and things that they're exposed to. And that's normally okay, normally well-packaged, well-preserved products, those kinds of interactions, they just happen. And over a period of a very long time, your product will wear out or degrade.

                                                But when you actually speed that reaction up by speeding up the interactions with the molecules, with something like heat, whether that's from sunlight or whether that's from artificial light or your heating lamp or the heat from your shower, you speed up the degradation reactions that are happening at a relatively low or slow pace. Just that alone, just the heating alone can result in changes to the product. Exposure to light also contributes to that process and then humidity and heat together encourage the growth of kind of microbes. So mould, bacteria, those kind of things. And that's all the reasons why heat, humidity, light, all the things that you find in absolute abundance in a bathroom are the worst place that you could actually have your products. I think I wrote in that article for anybody who's read it. There's the issue of toilets. So we're going to get into toilets.

Joanna Flemming:            Yes, we love toilet chat.

Hannah Furst:                    Yes. We love toilets.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Okay. We love toilet chat. Well, I know you girls like bum hair, so I figured toilets were not off limits. So when you flush the toilet and leave the lid up, you produce this kind of big plume of bacteria microbes into the air. If you've been in a hurry to get ready for work one morning, and you've got all your kind of cosmetics open, your powders and stuff, and you've had a bit of a [inaudible 00:12:47], and you happen to be the kind of person that has a toilet in their bathroom and the kind of person that flushes the toilet without putting the lid down, you're in danger of actually ending up with faecal microbes on your cosmetics.

Joanna Flemming:            Oh, no.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Yeah.

Joanna Flemming:            Oh no.

Hannah Furst:                    Oh my God. This is a game changing conversation.

Joanna Flemming:            I love that. It's really important information.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Yeah. So I think the two things there are, first of all, don't leave lids off things because enhanced exposure to oxygen and light, especially if you've got a jar product with an open lid and a big surface area, that will contribute to the breakdown of the product. But also, you leave your products sitting there for all these little microbes to land on it, and then you apply those to your face. I mean, there's all kinds of things that people put on their face in the interests of anti ageing in particular. But I feel like poo particles is not one of those things, but yet.

Joanna Flemming:            No.

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah. So I'm getting a sense that I may need a beauty fridge in my bathroom.

Dr Michele Squi...:           So there's a few ways you can go here. So if you want absolute, ultimate convenience, I think a beauty fridge is not a bad idea. If you insist on keeping your toilet seat up, no. If you insist on keeping things on your bathroom shelf, then a beauty fridge is probably not a bad way to go. Especially if you live in the parts of Australia that get really, really cold or really, really hot. So I think if you just want to keep things at a nice even temperature and you still want that convenience, you don't want to have to be running down stairs or running to another part of the house to get stuff out of the fridge. Then certainly a beauty fridge is a great idea.

Hannah Furst:                    Very interesting. And I always think about this. So sometimes I get like... I've got some new products and I don't want to open them because I'm like, "Once I open them, I've got 12 months or whatever." So I've got two questions. The first is, can I keep unopened skincare indefinitely? Or does skincare go off regardless if you open it or not.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Look, skincare goes off for a whole range of reasons. There's the packaging, whether it's airless, or whether it's transparent, or whether it's opaque, where you're keeping the unopened product as well, so where it's stored. So that in mind, most unopened products, if you store them kind of out of a hot bathroom, if you keep them in a kind of coolish, darkish spot, they should last three years unopened.

Hannah Furst:                    Great.

Joanna Flemming:            Well, that's good to know.

Hannah Furst:                    That's really good to know.

Dr Michele Squi...:           So a lot of our products will also have expirey dates on them. And also the period after opening date, which is the little kind of jar with the open lid symbol, and that tells you how long you've got after you've opened it before you should toss it out. And that's different for different formulations, packaging, preservatives, whatever.

Joanna Flemming:            A lot of people don't know that little tip, yeah.

Hannah Furst:                    Don't know.

Joanna Flemming:            A lot of people don't know that.

Hannah Furst:                    You check the bottom or the side of the product and it's got that little 12M or 6M-

Joanna Flemming:            Little icon, yeah.

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Yeah. And so the expirey date is often different to that. It will say best before, or expire, or you use by, or one of those types of things. And that's usually printed somewhere.

Hannah Furst:                    And does that mean, because I always wonder this, I'm particularly say my vitamin C which I know is not the most stable ingredient. Would I know if something's gone off or would it just not be working?

Dr Michele Squi...:           Yeah. Look, it's very hard. The nature of skincare is, despite all of the best marketing, usually you have to apply something to your face for a long period of time before you actually see results. So it's difficult to know whether something's working or not working overnight. So that's probably not a good way of telling. The changes you look for are things... You use your senses. So that could be a change in colour, a change in texture, separation, something smells rancid. And obviously if you put something on your face, all things being equal, you suddenly randomly decided to exfoliate for seven nights in a row and you put something on your face and it stings, that could be a change too, that could be something to be aware of as well.

                                                So if you've suddenly put something on and it stings, especially if it's combined with any of those other sensory changes, then that's a good sign that you're in trouble. If in doubt, toss.

Joanna Flemming:            When you said it starts to smell rancid, I was thinking... I don't know if you've used SkinCeuticals [inaudible 00:17:02], but it smells like deli meat.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Yes. Hot dog water. Yeah.

Joanna Flemming:            It does smell like hot dog water.

Hannah Furst:                    How would I even know that this smells rancid?

Joanna Flemming:            How would you know?

Dr Michele Squi...:           Well, maybe when it stops smelling rancid, you throw that one out.

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah. Start to smell flowers or florals and...

Joanna Flemming:            On the topic of things going off, now in a general sense, just including all cosmetics, we know from a previous episode that you're meant to chuck out your mascara every three months. Which other products are we hoarding for longer than we should? Is there a general expiry date for other things as well when you should throw them out? Because I know that I'm guilty of keeping makeup for too long. And I know that other people probably are as well. Skincare I'm a little bit better with, but is there an expiry to cosmetics in general?

Dr Michele Squi...:           I think in general terms, we all keep cosmetics for way too long. And I think you can kind of be... The three year rule probably still applies, if you were to ask a kind of regulation expert. The three year rule is a good rule of thumb that if you're still got something after three years-

Hannah Furst:                    I reckon I've kept a lipstick for 10 years and that smells rancid, I can tell you that much.

Joanna Flemming:            I've got MAC lipsticks that I bought in Las Vegas, I think eight years ago. So they need to go, but I just like having them there.

Dr Michele Squi...:           You need to speak to them and tell them how much joy they've brought you. And then toss those suckers.

Joanna Flemming:            Toss.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Yeah. So typically the kind of use-by on lipstick is 12 months.

Joanna Flemming:            Okay, I've gone way over that, haven't I? Yep.

Hannah Furst:                    You know the really bright pink one that I wore when I was like 15?

Joanna Flemming:            Yes.

Hannah Furst:                    That's one that I have, Candy Yum-Yum, by MAC. It's one of the ones I have from Vegas.

Dr Michele Squi...:           But I think the big thing that we all hoard, and I'm guilty of this, it's sunscreen.

Joanna Flemming:            Yes, good one.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Yeah. We have sunscreen in our beach bag and in the glove box of car and your handbag and all over the place. And then you kind of use it for a season. That's not the way it should be, because you know, I'm a sunscreen Nazi. You should be using it all year round.

Joanna Flemming:            100%.

Dr Michele Squi...:           In reality, we use more sunscreen on our bodies, I guess in summer. And then if you're going back to that kind of beach bag, glove box, whatever, the following summer and using that same sunscreen, that would be a no. So sunscreens, typically six months maximum. And that's another good reason to use it liberally because you can't save it till the following season, just get into it. Use it.

Hannah Furst:                    You've been researching skincare for decades. What are the biggest changes to formulations you've noticed in the last 10 years and which up and coming ingredients are you most excited about?

Dr Michele Squi...:           Ooh, hell. Okay. So there's a new ingredient every day, right? So-

Hannah Furst:                    I know.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Yeah. To be honest, I don't get that excited about new ingredients. I get much more excited about old ingredients because they have the weight of scientific evidence behind them. So I'm really actually quite sceptical of new ingredients. And in all honesty, the speed with which new ingredients come to market, I am a little sceptical about all the new ingredients that come out all the time. So there's that. Sorry to be a party pooper, but that's...

Joanna Flemming:            No, we appreciate the honesty.

Dr Michele Squi...:           That's me. You get the realness. I always err on the side of evidence and there's good quality evidence and then there's not so great quality evidence. And then there's a body of evidence where you get lots of people who all get the same finding in different studies, different really well constructed studies. So that's what I look for before I start recommending things. And obviously things like retinoic acid and tretinoin and those kinds of things, they're unimpeachable, the body of evidence is decades and decades and decades old. It's been proven over and over and over. So I've been killing dreams since 1969 in the new ingredients category.

Joanna Flemming:            What is the difference between cosmeceuticals and other categories of products? Like things that you can get from the pharmacy or the supermarket.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Okay. So this is a really good question. I'm a fan of cosmeceuticals, okay? I'll get that out there, I am a fan of cosmeceuticals. But I'm also a fan of pharmacy stuff as well and supermarket stuff because they do different yeah.

Joanna Flemming:            Yes. We dabble too.

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Yeah. I think people need to kind of get that kind of stuff in perspective. There's only two levels of regulation in Australia when it comes to these issues. So in Australia you have cosmetics. So they're things that change the appearance of something or cleanse it or make it pretty or smell pretty. They're anything that you buy without a medical prescription or behind the counter at the pharmacy. A therapeutic good is something that actually changes the functions of the body. And that's it. They're the only two categories. So cosmeceuticals, they fall between the two categories. Some parts of that are because there are... maybe our regulations are a little bit slow to catch up, but there should be a third category, perhaps. Some of it though is just marketing and actually what you've got is a cosmetic that's being marketed as a therapeutic. So it's a really a case of buyer beware.

                                                Kind of back to that previous question about what I'm most excited about in terms of new formulations and stuff. The thing I'm most excited about is transparency, where consumers now feel very empowered. And I think a lot of that has to do with social media because companies connect directly with their consumers and consumers now feel like they can ask questions directly of a company and the company will answer them and they've got a right to do that. So I think there are some cosmeceuticals and vitamin C is a really good example. There are some cosmeceuticals that do have an effect, but fall between the cracks, I guess. So, yes, I think we agree and disagree.

Hannah Furst:                    You make a really good point around people feeling more empowered to shop their skincare. And I think learning more about ingredients is something that I really encourage people to do, because I think that gives you the power to be able to look at what's in your products and go, "Actually that is probably going to have a really good effect on my skin or really do something to my skin," as opposed to not really doing much. But in terms of the price difference as well, how can you justify that price difference between a cosmeceutical and something you can buy in a pharmacy?

Dr Michele Squi...:           Well, I mean, typically cosmeceuticals will have a higher percentage of some kind of active ingredient and let's use the vitamin C example, and what you're paying for with a cosmeceutical version of something is the fact that hopefully you're paying for, let's look at C for [inaudible 00:23:37] for example, the SkinCeuticals product, you're paying for an enormous body of science that's gone into that. And you're paying for the right active concentration, the right type of vitamin C, the right pH.

                                                So in saying that though, there are certain product categories where price isn't necessarily a driver of whether something's better or worse, and cleansers and moisturisers are a really good example of that. So cleansers really only need to cleanse your skin and they're really not on your face for very long. So if you're paying a million bucks for some kind of cleanser that's meant to, I don't know, make you 10 years younger overnight, it's not going to happen. It's just not going to happen.

                                                If you're paying that because you can afford to pay that, and you like the way it feels on your skin and it takes all your makeup off and all of those kinds of things, which is what a cleanser is meant to do. And it's a textural preference for you, it's your holy grail cleanser, have at it, go for your life. But if you're paying something, if you're paying for a cleanser that you think is going to do all that, it's going to change your skin. It's not. It's become a very confusing world because there's so many products, there's so many new products, science has become a big deal. And everyone's trying to jump on that bandwagon and talk about the science of their products. It's become very confusing for the average consumer. Very, very confusing.

Joanna Flemming:            Yeah. Well, that's what brings us here, right? That's why we do the podcast.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Right? Exactly. Exactly.

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah. I found it a lot easier once I knew what the ingredients were and how they worked, because I only started this journey kind of two years ago and especially on this podcast, but once I learned about the ingredients, then I felt like, "Okay, now I can start playing around with different products." And I really liked what you said about the cleanser thing. Because my sister will only use the ASAP gentle cleanser because she likes the smell, the texture, it's gentle and she's happy to pay a little bit more. But-

Dr Michele Squi...:           Go for your life.

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah, I think that was a really good point that you made there. And yeah, my moisturiser, I'm like, "I honestly don't really care what the moisturiser costs." Because-

Joanna Flemming:            I think you make a good point on what you can save on and what you should spend on.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Exactly. And the other thing to remember though, just when you're researching ingredients, I see a lot of people who say, "Oh, I'm allergic to this, I'm allergic to that. I'm allergic to something else." There are very, very, very few products in the world that only contain a single ingredient. So keep in mind that just because that's the only ingredient you recognise on the label or on the ingredient list, it doesn't mean that you are not responding in either a positive or a negative way to something else. So I see people say, "Oh..." Like the whole hyaluronic acid. That's a whole other podcast.

Joanna Flemming:            Yes.

Hannah Furst:                    Yes. I so would love to get you back on to do that.

Joanna Flemming:            Definitely. As long as there's some poo chat in there at the same time, then I'm down to have you back on.

Dr Michele Squi...:           I can get poo chat into just about anything.

Joanna Flemming:            Thanks so much for joining us, Dr. Michele Squire, it's been great to chat to you today.

Dr Michele Squi...:           Absolute pleasure. Look forward to next time.

Joanna Flemming:            Actually I think both of our products today are still on the lockdown bandwagon. It feels like we've just done full circle back to March. Because today we're talking about two products that are lockdown friendly. For those of you are in Melbourne, those of you outside of Melbourne, you could also use these, but you have access to professional services. So Hannah, what's yours?

Hannah Furst:                    Well, mine's [Linda's 00:00:27:03].

Joanna Flemming:            Oh, yours is Linda's?

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah.

Joanna Flemming:            Okay. All right, Linda's got a PWDKWN today, please share.

Hannah Furst:                    I've got nothing left guys.

Joanna Flemming:            You've run out?

Hannah Furst:                    I've run out of products.

Joanna Flemming:            Is this your last episode?

Hannah Furst:                    Yeah, this is my last episode.

Joanna Flemming:            Okay, nice knowing you.

Hannah Furst:                    So my, well, Linda's is the L'Oreal professional hair touch up in, well, there's different colours, but she used brown. It's only $25. And if you are currently stuck in Melbourne, you know that hairdressers are no longer open. So if you are dealing weave grey roots that you actually can't go to the salon to get them dyed, or you don't want to do it at home yourself, this one is a water and sweat resistant, root touch-up sprays. And I actually filmed my mum as she tried it. And she did get some on her new purple top.

Joanna Flemming:            Oh dear.

Hannah Furst:                    She probably should have had a covering over her. So I'd probably recommend doing it after the shower or something, or in a robe or whatever. But yeah, I saw her put it on and it fully... She had two inches of, or an inch of grey roots and it completely covered it.

Joanna Flemming:            It's amazing, isn't it?

Hannah Furst:                    It was quite magical, really.

Joanna Flemming:            Amazing. I loved that video that Eva Longoria did, where she did her roots, it's like they disappear immediately. It's crazy. So my product today is actually a brow tinting product. At the start of isolation I did a very brief brow tutorial on my Instagram with the Maybelline tattoo brow stuff. I don't know what the full name is, tattoo brow something. Anyway, that lasts a couple of days. But this products, which is called Baebrow, is kind of similar. It's not a tint that you have to mix up. So if you ever used the 1,000 hour one that you've got to mix and it's quite hard to apply. You're more likely to make mistakes around your brows.

                                                So this one comes in a little, almost looks like a mascara tube, you open it up, it's got a little doe-foot on the end and it's got the tint in the tube. So you just literally use the end of the doe-foot applicator to apply it to your brows. And I think it's meant to last about a week. On me, I used the dark brown. That was perfect for my eyebrows. I probably could go black if I wanted to, because I could get away with being a little bit darker.

Hannah Furst:                    They're looking really good.

Joanna Flemming:            Thank you. There's also a graphite, which is more of a ashy based neutral colour, which can be used on pretty much everyone. So if you were really blonde, you'd probably use graphite. But the dark brown perfect for anyone with mid-brown hair, I would say. If you're a darker brown, I would probably say for you, Hannah, I'd probably go black because we've got about the same colour eyebrows I reckon.

Hannah Furst:                    I mean, I have quite liked the 1,000 hour. I did try it. I liked the idea of not having to mix it together, because you know how clumsy I am.

Joanna Flemming:            Exactly. It's just a bit messy and not having anything to apply it with either, I find that a lot of people don't have little tools around home to apply a brow tint with. So they're using like a cotton tip and then that gets outside the edges and stains your skin. So I would recommend putting Vaseline around the shape of your eyebrows so that if any of the tint does get outside the border of your brow, that it doesn't stain your skin. But apart from that, really good product to maintain your brows, especially in lockdown, if you can't go and get them done. But I would recommend shape your brows first, how you want them, and then do the tint over the top and then, voila, you're done. Perfect brows.

Hannah Furst:                    I'm a bit upset I didn't get sent one of those to be totally honest with you. You're getting old good products, it's really upsetting me.

Joanna Flemming:            Excuse me. I sent you the vagina mask.

Hannah Furst:                    You did. What I do want to finish this episode off on, is I think in transparency, we get sent a lot of products from brands that we stock [inaudible 00:30:34] and actually brands that we don't stock like Milky Foot.

Joanna Flemming:            Like Milk Foot.

Hannah Furst:                    But what I do want to say, Jo, is that I did a staff order. I wanted to talk about the actual products that I buy because I actually do buy products. This is the Maison Balzac incense holder and incense. I got a Lumira wick trimmer because I desperately... I get black hole over my fingers.

Joanna Flemming:            [inaudible 00:00:31:01], yeah.

Hannah Furst:                    This is for my sister, the ASAP cleansing gel.

Joanna Flemming:            Yep, I think she uses that because of me.

Hannah Furst:                    Yes she does. She can't use anything else. I got two boxes of the Lanolips multipurpose superbalm. And then I got a gift for someone which was the Glasshouse candle. So yeah.

Joanna Flemming:            So I've got my staff order up. So I'm ordering for my mum, the Kiehl's Clearly Corrective dark spot solution, because she ran out of it, and she said that it really worked on her dark spots. The MODELROCK lash curler, because my lash curler is literally 15 years old and it's trash, and I wanted a new one. And then Virtue Recovery shampoo and conditioner because I am loving them at the moment and I go through it really quickly. The Beauty Chef GLOW powder, because my dad, he's using it every day as well, so we're going through that really quickly. And then, because I'm obsessed with nail art at the moment, the OPI Infinite Shine, Alpine Snow, Witch, Chelsea [inaudible 00:31:52], Trophy Wife recommended as the best white that you can get.

Hannah Furst:                    Awesome. Well-

Joanna Flemming:            All right, well that's us.

Hannah Furst:                    That is it-

Joanna Flemming:            For this week. Tune in for another episode where we actually get to talk about all the products we purchase, because I actually do like that you did that disclaimer, Hannah, because we do get sent a lot of things, but also we wouldn't be able to do this podcast if we didn't get sent a lot of things so that we could talk about them.

Hannah Furst:                    I wouldn't be able to afford to do it.

Joanna Flemming:            Exactly. We'd be broke. Homeless.

Hannah Furst:                    McDonald's is taking all my money. So I can't spend any more on beauty products.

Joanna Flemming:            Yeah, exactly.

Hannah Furst:                    Thanks everyone for joining us today.

Joanna Flemming:            Don't forget to subscribe and tell your friends, it helps other people to discover us. And also we really want to know what you thought about this podcasts so if you can leave us a review, that would be much appreciated.

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